...and repent at leisure.
I volunteer, when I can, to do a shift in a local community interest charity/opshop/thrift shop which has at its roots a desire to assist low-impact living. Perhaps I might blog about that another time.
Today a delightful couple came in for coffee and tea. She had local connections and she and I had a chat while he was otherwise engaged. He is a retired clergyman. He said they lived in Inverness.
On their way out there was a discussion about the fact that I was "not from here". Although I suspect that I have lived here longer than they did given that I'm not far short of having lived on Lewis for half a century.
He then asked if he could preach me a short sermon. I declined the offer, gracefully I hope. There was an ensuing discussion as to why I'd declined his offer during which, of course, I refused to be drawn. He said that I had obviously seen The Darkness and not The Light.
Since that occurrence an hour or so ago I have been asking myself why I did that. What would it have cost me to just accept? I would not have created the possibility of him losing face in front of his wife. He could have gone away a happier man having felt that he had helped another sinner on his way to salvation.
Oh my, this hits home with me as just last week I was in a similar situation at the local Senior Center having lunch. My luncheon companions were a mix of ladies with varied backgrounds, and I found myself cutting short a conversation with one with whom I had no interest in nor inclination to get to know better. Now, I wasn't exactly rude, but I was not forthcoming when she wanted to "get to know me better!" I didn't have time to get to know her and what makes it worse, is that I could see she really needed someone, anyone, to talk to and help her through her loneliness. I felt so bad about the way I acted, but no way to make it up to her. I will confess, it gave me pause to think I could have helped her and I didn't.
ReplyDeleteJill, the one thing this incident has done for me is remind me to think more about the unintended consequences of my actions.
DeleteI can tolerate many things, Graham, but religious proselytizing is not one of them. People are welcome to their beliefs but I don’t wish them to try to foist them on me. I think you did exactly the right thing and should have no regrets.
ReplyDeleteDavid, logically and in accordance with my beliefs I was in the 'right' and I agree with you but if I'd let him do it I would not have suffered and he and his wife would not have been snubbed.
DeleteAh. Sounds like he may have kind of succeeded in his mission after all... (making you repent...) ;-)
ReplyDeleteThanks for that piece of logic, Monica.
DeleteYou're welcome, Graham! 😉
DeleteInteresting discussion.
ReplyDeleteHe was being him. You were being you. Opposing views is life. His putting you down is his darkness, not yours.
You could asked him for a short sketch description of the darkness in case you happen upon such a thing, given he seems to know more about it than you.
Maywyn, in a way I wish that I'd had the presence of mind to do something like that but he definitely blind-sided me and I was totally unprepared.
DeleteI think that's a very strange thing to offer. Perhaps he thought he had not done enough in his pre-retirement ministry. Don''t feel bad - you've no idea how long his 'short sermon' might have been.
ReplyDeleteJanice, I have to admit that the prospect of a Free Church sermon was a very daunting thing. Since then I've been told that they are usually "fairly short". I'm not the first person to have been hijacked.
DeleteWell, it was an offer, and every offer made can potentially be declined, something the clergyman should have been aware of. And since I simply can not imagine you having been rude, there really was no need for him to be offended.
ReplyDeleteI love Monica‘s comment!
Meike, I'm sure that he should be able to cope with it but I suspect that, especially in the Islands, he's used to people refusing his offer. I don't feel that I was rude, just rather inconsiderate of his feelings. I appreciated Monica's comment too!
DeleteCorrection! NOT used to people refusing his offer. A very fundamental mistake.
Delete'Preaching at' outside of church, even a short sermon, is nothing short of weird. It is totally one sided and borders on pomposity. A conversation or discussion is a normal human interaction in a personal setting. It is also pompous to assume his way is light and yours therefore directly opposed. What does he really know about you?
ReplyDeleteF (if I may be so familiar) I agree with you and despite living here in the centre of the Scottish Free Church domain for nearly half a century it's the first time I've had that offer. He had never met me before and as It is nearly 30 years since I was in the 'public eye' he is unlikely to ever have heard of me before.
DeleteWhat kind of lunatic goes around offering to preach sermons to individuals?
ReplyDeleteHe was sitting up and begging to lose face.
Kylie, here in the centre of the Scottish Free Church's domain I suspect he is very unused to anyone refusing his offer however unusual it may be.
DeleteAlso, I think the only person I know who uses "act in haste, repent at leisure" is my mum. It was nice to see it here
DeleteAsking for trouble. Could you have said something that brought that on? Would a retired maths teacher offer you a brief introduction to logarithms, or a retired proctologist a quick look up your bum, or a retired politician a summary of their views?
ReplyDeleteTasker, now that I've stopped chuckling at your comment I'm a little unsure about the politician.
DeleteI think how dare he make such assumptions about you and ask you an inappropriate question that made you feel uncomfortable. Sometimes perfectly nice people can so easily and quickly disappoint you.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Andrew. Seeing your and other comments this morning has, I think, swept away my guilt feelings.
DeleteYOU DID THE RIGHT THING. THIS GUY WAS PUSHY AND WANTED TO TELL SOMETHING THT YOU HAD A CHOICE OF NOT HEARING. I LIKE TSKER'S COMMENT.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Red.
DeleteFrom my experience of sermons, you might have been listening for an hour or more. No, you did the right thing, he should reserve his preaching for those who go willingly, not for those who are shanghaied.
ReplyDeleteCro, that certainly was my initial reaction.
DeleteI think only one person was rude and inconsiderate of the other here, and it wasn't you! How very arrogant he sounds. I think you were well mannered and restrained.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Barbara.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteHere, there is (are?) something called 'evangelicals'. This fellow sounds like one. They espouse such a different take on Christianity that truly, I don't think Christians should listen to them. I had one tell me that we should not help anyone unless they first professed a belief in Christ. Imagine! They are doing great damage in our country now, because they have the idea that we all need to conform our lives to fit their view of God, and want to enact laws that enforce that, not unlike the Taliban.
ReplyDeleteThat being said, I was waiting for a friend in my car. A man approached me, hand extended with a little pamphlet, urging me to read it. I saw Jesus emblazened on the face of it and said, 'No thank you." He told me that it would answer my questions about whether I was going to heaven or not. I said, "Thank you, but I haven't got any questions.'
I'm sure he walked away thinking that here I was, another miserable sinner that refused to listen. I sat there knowing that I would have received a message that I disagreed with with every fiber of my being. I knew that if I had spoken my own truth, he would have refused to listen.
We have a right to set boundaries in our life. A discussion? Sure. That is the gift of mutuality, both sides bringing their thoughts to the table. Why would one want to open the door to someone a onesided sermon of a belief system one disagrees with?
Thank you, Debby. I admire and fully agree with your approach. The idea of the Evangelicals you mentioned scare the living daylights of of me. The Free Church of Scotland (of which I assume he was a member) is for ever breaking into schisms vying for who can be the 'true path' to the upholding of the Bible (largely based on the Old Testament). They largely ruled this Island 50 years ago.
DeleteI think that when you are breaking your church up over arguments about the old testament, you've already lost the thread, so to speak.
DeleteHe doesn't know you so I think it was bold of him to suggest you needed enlightening. I think your polite refusal was perfectly acceptable. I would have done the same.
ReplyDeleteThanks for your support, Ellen.
DeleteI know any reply you made would be 10 times more polite than anything I may have said in response to anyone who said I had seen the darkness but not the light. Those that knock on our doors and offer to share the light are always exceedingly polite. I think that man must have been something of a zealot, he put you in an unenviable position, not the other way around. I feel that people who don't accept a "No, thank you." are rude and probably expect rudeness in return so they can walk away polishing their halos.
ReplyDeletePauline, he probably was used to refusals. I think, though, that until that moment we had all been having a very civilised conversation and he probably hadn't bargained on my refusal and perhaps overreacted a bit to my statement that I had seen my own light. I've just been reminded by a neighbour in New Zealand who had a notice on the gate (to the lifestyle plot so a good way from the house) saying "No Bludgers, Hawkers or God Botherers'
DeleteReminded 'of' not 'by'.
Deletei think you did the right thing. We had that happen to us once but in a more polite way. Bill said , "I would rather you did that in your own home." He accepted that and is still friends with us but he respects our beliefs as we respect his.
ReplyDeleteDiane, when Free Church friends come to dinner they always say grace as a matter of course and that used to be the norm anywhere even in restaurants and I tolerated it.
DeleteChristian zealots are often presumptuous about their beliefs. You did not ask him to listen to a short sermon from the viewpoint of a good citizen who does not need the crutch of God and Jesus to live a fulfilling life.
ReplyDeleteIndeed I didn't, YP, but I'd like to have seen his face if I had done so.
DeleteI would argue what right did he have to impose his beliefs onto you, and that it was not you who was impolite here. X
ReplyDeleteSorry, Jules, your comment went to Spam. Thanks. for your support.
DeleteI think you dealt with it politely and perfectly. I would struggle to manage that.
ReplyDeleteI have several part time jobs. I know that folk are nice to me and I try to reciprocate but after a few years here they know not to espouse lefty crap or pontificate on religious matters. At the end of the day we all want a good job done quickly and a hefty wedge of money for doing it. We haven't got the time or inclination to debate politics.
What I have noticed is that I'm being used as a negotiator. I have closed a rift between a haircutter and a bloke who was going to Perth for a haircut. He can get it done in the town for ten pounds less and save on diesel. Two families with about 300 hectares between them didn't speak for years. Today we have a big machine out ploughing, another farmer has a similar bit of tackle cultivating and the owner is following drilling winter barley. The operation will be shifted to the other farm as soon as the first is done.
I accept I'm used as a negotiator because I'm an English Twat and can be blamed if it all goes tits up.
I can also do the jobs they do. Maybe not quite as well but good enough is near enough.
Well done for being polite. Politeness costs nothing to confident folk.
Thank you Adrian for your usual entertaining and subtle approach to life the universe and everything.
DeleteI would have done similar to what you did, Graham.
ReplyDeleteA couple of months ago I had a very nice conversation with an elderly, fine gentleman, whom I'd not met before...whom I didn't know. As our chat progressed I discovered he was/is a retired Presbyterian minister. We were discussing a certain event that is occurring down this way, and we shared a couple of tales.
As we parted ways, he said to me, with a smile, "God be with you." I laughed and replied, "Cut that out!"
He laughed along with me, and on our merry ways we went. :)
Lee, I've never see a Scottish Free Presbyterian Minister smile, never mind laugh.
DeleteYou are being far too hard on yourself. Ditto everything Jules said :-}.
ReplyDeleteIf he had just been a lonely chap needing some conversation then yes, shutting him down might not have been your finest hour. But politely declining a lecture on someone else’s beliefs is, I think, still quite acceptable.
Jayne, he definitely wasn't in need of conversation and his wife was very interesting but he was simply proselytizing.
DeleteI think his mentioning of 'darkness' took him over the line and your instinctive response was sound.
ReplyDeleteHi Rosemary, it's a while since we visited each other (or commented anyway) and it's good to see you again. Thank you for your reassuring words.
Delete